When I was in the process of selling the Forrest Fenn Treasure, there appeared at one time an opportunity to sell the whole thing to someone who planned to put it back out in nature to start a new hunt.

I could think of no greater gift to all those who loved the first hunt than to see it put back out there to be found again. Unfortunately, what seemed like a firm offer eventually fizzled out.

But at around the same time, a man named Jon Collins-Black let me know he was preparing a treasure hunt of his own, inspired in part by his own love of Forrest’s hunt, and wanted to include some of Forrest’s treasure in with his own.

I’m thrilled to now see his plan has worked out.

Jon’s book, There’s Treasure Inside, is out tomorrow, and among the millions of dollars worth of treasure he has apparently hidden is a box of items from the original Fenn treasure chest, including gold and the jarred autobiography. Most exciting for me is that it contains what I considered to be the most magical treasure in the bronze box, the necklace of Tairona and Sinu animal fetishes.

Just as Forrest described in his book, these ancient crafts seem to emanate a special power, and I compulsively put the necklace on myself the first time I laid eyes on it. It was a profound moment I don’t think I’ll ever forget. At that moment, I had sense of my tiny place in the sweep of humanity’s history and our place in the universe. I was connected to the past in such a tangible way I had never experienced looking through the glass at artifacts in a museum, and suddenly I understood why these things had such a draw for Forrest.

I’ll be buying Jon’s book, and while I can’t promise I won’t come out of treasure-hunting retirement to go looking for some of his riches, I will leave the box with Forrest’s treasures for another person to find. I hope it will be found by someone who searched for it the first time, and I hope their second chance is just as sweet as my find was.

Thank you to Jon for putting this out there in the world. To the searchers, have great adventures, stay safe, and remember what it’s all about — it’s the thrill of the chase.

I have come to understand that the group of buyers had decided to keep certain items of the treasure for themselves but were eager to buy the rest of it as well as they were interested in speculating on the price they could achieve on it in a public sale.

The current owners (who wish to remain anonymous) informed me they are today offering the items of the treasure they have not retained for themselves in a one-time sale through Heritage Auctions.

After my identity was revealed almost two years ago, some fans of the treasure hunt reached out to tell me they hoped they could purchase an item from the treasure to commemorate their own adventures searching for it. I’m happy that today those people finally have the opportunity to do so, with a large number of items from which to choose.

I wish them, the current owners of the treasure, and Heritage the best of luck at auction.

As you might expect, I get fewer emails these days than I did when I was first outed as the finder. The vast majority of searchers have been kind and respectful of the responsibility I have to protect the location where the treasure was secreted (and, therefore, the answers to the clues that lead there). At this point, they’ve done a good job at figuring out the bounds of what I feel I can responsibly share about my perspective on Forrest’s poem, his words, and what logic dictated was possible, without revealing details that I feel would go beyond what Forrest already said about his hunt, or would start to narrow things down or lead people to the right solution and location.

And by now, I don’t feel I have much more to add. At some point, I will probably stop answering questions, perhaps after I sell the treasure. I may write more on the treasure hunt in the future, but right now I look forward to a day where I don’t think about the treasure or this hunt at all. As much as I love it, there hasn’t been a day like that for me since I first heard of Forrest Fenn in 2018.

So let this be an impetus to searchers out there—if you have a nagging question but aren’t quite sure how to ask it or can think of a new area of inquiry you think I may feel comfortable exploring, work on that now. I continue to take questions at jack85319834@gmail.com for the time being.

As in previous installments, my answers to the emails below are in bold.

I hope you don’t mind my ramblings now and then. And to be honest, even though myself and many others are continuing “the search”, I don’t see how we will ever be sure of a find considering the state of what once was a blaze. Which makes me think of a question. Do you think that if the blaze was in it’s original form that others before you may have had a shot at a find? Or was it really that obscure both in location and recognition?

Enjoy and appreciate your responses,

Donna-Geysergirl

That’s something that I’ve asked myself a lot. I think it’s obvious it’s more likely to have been found earlier, but I don’t know how likely. For what it’s worth, I don’t think I went to that section of the forest in my first year searching, yet I had felt I had covered the territory very well.

Hi Jack, congratulations on finding the chest. I hope it helps you redirect your life to a better place. I can pretend that I understand: medical school and residency were extremely trying times for me. I count myself as fortunate that the many years in the profession since have been much, much kinder to me.

A question for you: did the structure of TTOTC have any bearing on your solution? I believe you said that TTOTC had only a few useful hints, so I suspect your answer will be “no.”

I hope you know what I mean by the structure of TTOTC (e.g. at the broadest level, shared theme and imagery between consecutive pairs of chapters). Some caveats: I’m the first to admit that I’m no Harold Bloom, that the human mind seeks to impose meaning where there is none, and that the presence of structure does not make it relevant to the problem at hand. With that being said, I’m fairly confident that TTOTC has an unusually intricate structure for an essentially amateur creative writer and I’m fairly confident that Forrest must have intentionally crafted it that way. I remain uncertain as to why: was it simply artfulness on his part, is it meant to make his readers take him and his game more seriously, and/or does it have any bearing on the solution? Regardless of the reason, I applaud what likely was a monumental effort on Forrest’s part and even more so if all that effort has no bearing on the solution!

Congratulations once again and many well wishes,
Jeff

Thanks Jeff. It’s certainly something I considered. I tried to analyze every decision he made in his writing.

Hi Jack, I have some questions again if you don’t mind helping me out.

1. Today I ordered a copy of Caro’s book so I can learn his research methodology. Are there any other skills you’d recommend adding to my mental toolkit that might help guide my thinking in the correct direction?

2. It seems clear to me that two of Forrest’s nine clues resolve to a starting point and an ending marker. Do you think the middle seven clues resolve to seven individual geographic points (or geographic areas)?

3. You no doubt noticed that Forrest added the words “clue” and “hint” to the text of two respective stories in TTOTC. Would it be generally accurate to say that the hints in Forrest’s memoir demonstrate by example how to solve the clues?

Rudy Greene

1. That’s a tough one. Try to think like a writer and editor. Forrest wanted to be taken seriously as a writer. Don’t forget that.

2. They all exist in the physical world and in the geography of the area.

3. Based on his description of hints, a hint is meant to help you with a clue, not the whole poem.

#1 Are their any questions that you would have liked to ask Forrest, or even ones now that you’ve thought of post-find, that you wish you could? If so, could you share any with me?

#2 The slip ups you speak of. Are they in the original versions of the videos, or is there extra work (such as how you got the uncut version of the New Mexico video) that one would have to do in order to witness them?

Thanks Jack.

Billy P

1. There are a couple things people have asked me about that I wish I’d asked. I think the biggest thing is I wish I could have sat down with him and heard the whole story from start to finish — coming up with the idea, designing it, and seeing people search, without him having to hold anything back.

2. The sources of the slip-ups were both on Dal’s media-coverage page, so no, no extra work tracking them down. I don’t want to narrow it down more than that, Billy.

Hey Jack… Did you read The Codex?

Tommy

Yes. What did you think about it?

…found it interesting. What did you think of it?

Tommy

Interesting to see the funhouse mirror portrait of Forrest. But the most interesting part was how little time the characters spent figuring out where he was headed, compared to our chase.

Jack,

As many have told you already, congrats on finding the chest, quite the accomplishment. I don’t really have any questions, just wanted to share a thought.

I remember thinking several times that I kind of didn’t want to find it due to some of the personalities of other searchers I saw on forums and those that threatened Forrest. Also being an introvert I didn’t want the attention. However I was addicted to the puzzle behind it. On my last BOTG I didn’t care if I found the chest, but I just wanted to know if I was right… that’s probably closure that a lot of people want. I fully understand the concept of keeping the place a secret and hope it can remain like that for years to come… I’ve gotten over my ego.

My idea of a solve was on a little chunk of land in Cortez, CO surrounded by Ute land and it was not an easy road to get there…so many coincidences led me there but selective perception got the best of me like it did for so many. I think the most interesting thing to observe was how stubborn one could get with this kind of challenge. It was all good fun and quite the learning experience though.

I guess I am curious about something…did you mirror any of the artwork in the book and overlay it on a map as part of your solve?

Best of luck to you in your future endeavors.

Kind Regards,

Wolfgang

Thanks Wolfgang. No, I didn’t. That’s overcomplicating it.

Hi Jack

I was late to the Forest Fenn Treasure hunt but really enjoyed trying to figure it out. I never did get a copy of TTOTC so was just going off the poem but still had fun.

I am a teacher’s aide that works with behavioural kids and special-needs kids at an elementary school in British Columbia.

Every Easter I secretly hide eggs for the students all around the schoolyard.

I make it difficult on purpose as I want it to be a challenge. I have noticed three types of searchers for my egg hunt: 1. The type that are doggedly trying to find eggs. 2. The ones that just follow me around begging for clues, crying for clues, telling me they have never found one /sob story. 3. The ones that search but often will come back and listen in to see if I have given any clues.

I am very much the guy who doesn’t want any clues and wants to find it honourably without help. I was wondering which type of searcher you would fall under?

I did find at some points I felt almost justified in misleading kids who just begged for clues or cried to get clues. Do you think Forest was the type that thought you must just use the clues provided, or did he have the use any strategy possible, “all is fair in love and war” mentality?

Congrats from RealChippendeal

Thanks for the laugh. I suppose I was in category three, but I was interested in what he said on the record, not gossip and hearsay.

I guess there is a fine line between joking with people and actively misleading them when you know that people are hanging on your every word. I know when I answer people’s emails on the subject of the treasure hunt, I try to hold myself back from making jokes because I know some people will let themselves miss the joke and read too much into what I’m saying. But it’s natural to want to have some fun with people, and even when you’re trying to be serious and precise, people will find a way to take things the wrong way.

Cynthia Meachum emailed me on this subject some weeks ago. This is what I told her:

“I was one of those searchers who were uncomfortable with the idea that others got to spend time with Forrest and potentially get more information, especially after I realized he had slipped up a little bit in front of the media before. And of course there was a little bit of jealousy that you got to meet him. But I think that access was a double-edged sword. Searchers, myself included, were prone to overvalue what they heard from him directly relative to other information. That’s human nature. And because the guy enjoyed being playful and asking questions, the circumstances were ripe for people to read too much into what he was telling them. So you may have had some advantages in having a direct line of communication with him, but I’d say it was also a disadvantage.”

Hi Jack,

Well, Dal states Forrest told him he’d driven within 300' of the chest. Care to confirm if the chest was indeed stashed within 300' of a road?

https://dalneitzelblog.wordpress.com/2021/05/18/email-where-ive-been/

Rick

That’s a strange one, Rick. I don’t usually want to get involved when people claim to have emails with secrets, partly because Forrest isn’t around to refute them. (But I have a lot of respect for Dal and don’t think he would make up this email.) The bigger issue is I don’t want to get suckered into ruling out parts of Wyoming based on the claims people make. But I feel comfortable on this one because Forrest is already on record ruling this out. The treasure was not located in close proximity to a man-made trail, and what Dal is describing — a road within 300 feet — is clearly a man-made trail in close proximity. It’s just not possible he drove that close to where the treasure was (unless he was in a flying car, I guess). Sounds to me like Forrest was just messing with Dal.

A searcher recently asked me if a trail made by people riding horses would be considered a man-made trail or a game trail. That gave me a laugh. Yes, I would consider that a man-made trail. I guess you might say a trail made by wild horses would be a game trail, but Forrest wasn’t trying to trick anyone with his statement, and I wasn’t trying to trick anyone when I said there were game trails nearby.

Hi, Jack.

I noticed this in one of your answers to a searcher who asked if you identified all the clues: I was right on what all of them referred to, but I will say there was some additional nuance to one of them for him that I would not have expected.

Forrest once told us to talk about the clue that searchers could discover for themselves but haven’t.

Could the additional nuance to one of the clues be that additional clue he told us to look for? Or, if it was a separate clue, did you figure it out?

Thanks,

Steve from Iowa

Hi Steve. I don’t think it’s possible any searcher could have figured out that additional nuance.

Hi Jack,

Allow me to be the millionth person to congratulate you on finding the chest, and I suspect also the millionth who has follow up questions. Compared to others you’ve answered via the Medium posts, I hope that mine are relatively straight forward and not too intrusive: how do you know that the blaze was damaged “relatively early in the search” if you didn’t get involved until 2018? Or, if you can’t answer that comfortably, can you at least answer if are you completely certain that it was damaged early on? And related to that, what time frame constitutes “relatively early” in this case?

Thanks for your time and I’m sorry for all the hassle you’ve surely experienced and will continue to experience via entitled fellow searchers.

Casa

Thanks Casa. When I made that comment, I was using “relatively early” to mean early in the scope of how long this thing could have lasted. Forrest envisioned that it could have taken decades or centuries to be found. And I always tried to keep that perspective, that in some way I was competing against searchers many years in the future.

Hi Jack,

Its raining here and I’ve been starring at the water droplets on my windshield for about an hour and a half thinking about Forrest. Is there a natural sciences building involved during the process of solving Forrest’s poem? If not did you find yourself going inside a structure that resulted in helping you know what to do or where to go at any point? I know he said it wasn’t associated with any structure but this is me just being sassy and still curious if one or more structures may be involved…

Sir Lancelot

No. I did go to some libraries for information, but those were all dead ends.

Jack,

First of all, let me give you the obligatory statement: congratulations on finding the Forrest Fenn Treasure. With that out of the way, I want to tell you that I am quite amazed that you searched for a combined total of 25 days. 25 days? I searched for less than 25 minutes. Actually, my search was part of a 5,000 mile round trip vacation to Yellowstone in 2019. When I arrived at my location, my ADD kicked in, and 10 minutes later I left to finish the rest of my vacation. Anyway, I have a question for you. If you did not find the treasure, and you never found the treasure, how much longer would you have searched until you permanently gave up?

Just wondering,

Brad

P.S. I one day expect a TED talk from you discussing determination.

Thanks Brad. I don’t think I would have ever permanently given up, but I probably would spend fewer (if any) days there each year until I figured out a better way of searching or a new technology came along. I left detailed notes for my family so that they could have picked up the search if something happened to me. I’ve since destroyed those.

Greetings. First, congrats on finding the treasure chest. While I do envy the experience you had with the discovery of the treasure I do not envy the issues that the discovery brought you. I am hoping you would be able to answer a question I have regarding the design of the puzzle. I have been a puzzle designer for magazines as well as escape rooms. Puzzles and games are an area of study for me.

Many big puzzles and treasure hunts have puzzles that reinforce the solution with confirmers. Masquerade treasure hunt came up with an exact sentence that explained how to find it, and using the first letter of each word reinforced the solution by naming the town to begin in. Some suggested Forrest Fenn hid GPS coordinates in the poem that provide a second level of information. (I believe the GPS solution has been discredited, so I only used it here as an example.)

My question is this: Does the solution of the puzzle reinforce itself with confirmers from the puzzles?

Thank you for considering answering this question.

James

James, Forrest didn’t share your exact interest in puzzles. He did not set out to create an intricate puzzle designed to satisfy people who are interested in such things. It’s a different thing — a very personal poem that depicts how he saw this place and the journey there. So no, it doesn’t include “confirmers” as you describe.

Thank you for answering my question. It is going to take me a while to come to terms with what you said. Even search friends of mine refuse to believe it, but I think that is human nature at work.

One quick followup question if I could…

You focused on Forrest and discovered a slip up that you were able to fit into the poem and find the treasure. You had confidence in your solution, but everyone has confidence in their solution. There are a lot of locations that seem to fit into the poem.

Do the words Forrest chose for his poem (or poem and book) point to the hiding place to the exclusion of all other places?

James

Well, I hope that wasn’t too harsh, and I’m sure that approach would be valid in many other, if not most, treasure hunts. And I can’t really say you were doing it “wrong” just because you couldn’t figure out where the treasure was that way — the point was to have fun in a spirit of adventure, and if you were doing that in your own way, you were doing it right. I’m fortunate this hunt was designed in a way that happened to reward the methods of inquiry to which I would naturally gravitate.

To answer your question — absolutely. But writing also has a way of revealing ourselves in a way that is not always a conscious choice.

Hello Jack,

I watched your video on cognitive bias, I’ve tried to rid my solves of it; albeit unsuccessfully. I cant seem to start over. I enjoy spending a little alone time each week delving into rabbit holes I either come across or myself, dig. I have been alone in this armchair chase for 5 years and have nobody to discuss this with here in California, by choice. Its mine and selfishly, I love that personal aspect of it.

You mentioned that there is evidence right in front of people. To be so blunt and not dance around it…I cannot see said hard evidence in any of the research I have done. I am asking you for not a direct hint but a subtle lead. Please, would you give me advise on the proper way to chose my rabbit hole wisely. I have chosen quite poorly!

Cheers from California.

Mike

Mike, I never felt I got into a rabbit hole. If I didn’t have a direct reason to go down a path of research, it was just guessing and therefore unlikely to be fruitful, or worse, misleading. The hard evidence comes from a process of connecting the dots, considering the big picture, never losing sight of what it is that you’re looking for, and never forgetting who Forrest was and what he wanted to do. Rather than putting together a solve, maybe you should let the solution put itself together. Good luck.

Hi, Jack. I hope you are still answering questions. If so, here’s mine:

Forrest said the locations represented by the clues are contiguous. The dictionary defines “contiguous” as:

1. Touching; in contact (e.g. the 48 contiguous states).

2. In close proximity without actually touching; near.

I suspect the second definition is the one that applies. With the exception of “not far but too far to walk”, do you agree?

Thanks.

Steve from Iowa

The clues in the poem are basically a set of directions. They are contiguous in the same way any set of directions are.

Thanks to all who have asked questions and to those here who allowed me to share theirs so that other searchers could benefit from them.

As a side note, for those who are interested in reading more from me, I was interviewed for Dan Barbarisi’s book, Chasing the Thrill, which was released earlier this month. There is some very fine writing in the book, but I have a few small corrections to make:

I did not “sell” Forrest’s bracelet when I returned it to him. No money exchanged hands.

I don’t play poker or have any real interest in it.

In the photo we released of the treasure in the forest I took soon after I found it, there is no reflection of me in the olive jar. What people have interpreted as a reflection is wax. The jar was dirty, so I don’t think its glass could have reflected anything anyway.

I haven’t been able to get to all of them, but I’ve tried my best to get back to people when I’ve had time. It’s been an unexpected pleasure to answer them. If you have a question you think I would feel comfortable answering, you can send it to me at jack85319834@gmail.com.

I’ve answered a number of questions since the last installment of “Jack Gets Mail” that I thought were particularly illuminating or would be of interest to the wider group of searchers, so I’ve put together another roundup of those emails. My responses are all in bold below.

Hey Jack,

A lot of people have commented on how clean the chest looked in the photo with you and Forrest, did you clean it up? And did you go through or inventory the chest before meeting with Forrest. I ask that second question because I know I would have gone through it piece by piece. One last thing, did you find it strange to see a rusty pair of scissors in the chest? Any idea what they were used for?

Thanks

Kevin S.

1. The treasure was filthy, and dirt got all over the interior bag I had it in. I spent a night at a hotel on my way to New Mexico and wiped dirt off everything with the hotel towels (not with any type of soap or cleaner, just occasionally wetting them a little bit). I went through all the towels in the room and left them totally brown from all the dirt. I left a nice tip.

2. Yes. As was Forrest. It was in a Ziploc with the dragon bracelet, which was covered in paper towel, so my only guess was he cut the paper towel with them, but that doesn’t seem like a very good guess.

Hi Jack, I hope you had a Merry Christmas, I have two questions concerning the final clue that you might entertain answering. We were absolutely certain of our search location but it was still like searching for a needle in a haystack.

My question is,. #1 Is there something in the poem or in the hints in the book that significantly narrows down the search area for the blaze once in the final area? #2. If the answer is yes, would you specify whether that information is in the poem, or in the hints in the book? Thanks.

Chris McNeal

Depends on your definition of “significantly.” The poem directs you to a section of forest in which to search for the blaze, but that is something you had to search for. Something like a needle in a haystack is accurate, but maybe slightly easier than that, or at least that was the design.

Q1 — Are Forrest Fenn’s ashes at or are going to be at the treasure location?

Q2 — Have you thought about saving the same location to have your ashes rest?

I seen in another email you sent, that you had been within 6’ of the treasure at one time on a previous search. That kinda blew my mind, that someone actively searching could be so close and not know.

Q3 — If everything went as FF had first planned and took his life at the spot. Do you think you would have found the treasure a lot sooner with a body at the spot?

Logan T.

1. I will say I was aware of that comment and did offer to make that happen. His family wants that stuff to remain private, so I will not reveal if I did or not. But if you’re asking in the hopes you could find an urn there, no you could not.

2. No

3. Certainly

Hello Jack,

Did the solve involve the use of synonyms for words found in the poem clues?

Thx, ken from oklahoma

Do you mean substituting synonyms for the words of the poem so that they would make sense? No. He wrote what he wanted to say. The poem is straightforward.

hi.

first off i would just like to congratulate you. i bought the book a few years ago and half heartedly followed on the internet but didn’t put in the effort that you did — nor am i nearly as clever:)

also i’m a full-time trader so we have that in common. from what i have seen, this profession is well-suited to someone with your logic/makeup.

anyways i have a specific location that requires climbing underneath a fence with barbed wire on top or somehow getting around the fence. did you have a similar experience? would at least let me know if i have been mistakenly attached to this spot.

congrats again!

Guy

Thanks Guy. No, I didn’t encounter a fence or barbed wire. If that were involved, the poem would have to mention it, I think.

HI Jack,

I’ve been pondering the problem of you being willing to communicate with other seekers, wanting to provide useful and interesting information, but not wanting to give away the treasure site. That’s a rather daunting list of objectives. I think that I might have found a topic that you can address.

Forrest Fenn said multiple times that it could take hundreds of years for a seeker to succeed. He clearly planned for this (like wax sealing the glass olive jar). And as an antiquities dealer with mountain experience, he would have seen a lot of old things and know how things survive in good shape (as well as the damages that can occur). He also said that he selected the treasure location with care: “I considered mudslides, forest fires, earthquakes, and floods….” These statements set up a few questions that I think are safe for you to answer:

1. The key was highly rusted and it looks like it wouldn’t have lasted another decade. Did Forrest Fenn simply overlook the effects of time and moisture on the key, or did some protection he have for the key fail?

2. With a bronze chest and the lock appearing in good condition, why is the key steel/iron? Is this an original key, or a cheap replica? Is the chest’s lock mechanism also steel/iron (and if so did it suffer the same rusty fate)?

3. You have stated that the blaze was damaged by nature and that you didn’t initially recognize it as the blaze — even 6 feet away. Specifically, was it the damage that threw you off, or not knowing exactly what that blaze was at that first encounter?

4. Was the natural damage that the blaze suffered something that occurred slowly (like erosion, settling, etc.) or rather suddenly (like, if not specifically, the things Forrest Fenn lists: mudslides, forest fires, earthquakes, and floods)?

5. Was the damage the blaze suffered just poor dumb luck (like a tree falling, of all places, directly on the blaze or a localized landslide on an apparently stable slope occurring right at the chest site), or did Forrest Fenn simply grossly underestimate the ravishes of time and the forces of nature?

I think that the answers to these questions would be interesting to say the least, but too general to peg the treasure’s former location. What do you think?

Thanks so much for your time,

Devin Ross

1. He said he put it inside rather than in the lock because he knew it would rust.

2. I don’t know, actually. Maybe you can ask the DIA if they have a key for their version of the chest.

3. The damage

4. Suddenly

5. Forrest left it up to fate to decide.

Jack,

I am still trying to solve the poem on my own. I’ve spent so much time working on it that I feel the need for that closure to find what I missed. I watched your video on confirmation bias and thought it was extremely helpful. I think a majority of searchers were looking for a linear solution to a non-linear equation. My only Wyoming solve was my first one and it was (very) weak. Since the announcement that it was found in Wyoming, I’ve been working on a new Wyoming solve. My best guess is at Amelia Earhart’s cabin near Meeteetse. Below are all the coincidences that lead me to Amelia’s cabin. I am curious what you think and would appreciate your feedback, is this a tremendous amount of confirmation bias or a plethora of red herrings?

Congrats again,

Carrie

[Carrie then includes a long list of all the coincidences she found]

It’s probably easy to tally up coincidences on any subject, and that’s why so many searchers felt they wound up in rabbit holes. To me, you need evidence that he intended something to be a hint in order to consider it as such, and I was happy to leave legitimate hints on the table if they didn’t meet that high burden of proof. It’s also important to note he once gave us an idea of how many hints were in TTOTC, and it wasn’t very many.

Hi Jack,

It seems like you tried to research everything about Forrest Fenn, including everything he ever wrote or said about the Chase.

So my question is:

If you only had the “Thrill of the Chase” book (and went BOTG of course) would you have been able to solve the poem and find the treasure?

In other words, were any of the “after the fact” Forrest Fenn quotes critical to your solve?

Thanks as always,

~Allen K

Allen, hypotheticals are always difficult to answer with any accuracy. If TTOTC was the only piece of writing he ever wrote, I would have found that very strange. The natural inclination for me would still be to research the man as much as possible. If something had happened to him and he never had the chance to answer questions about the treasure hunt, I would have had a harder time believing it was real, so I may have just decided there was too much uncertainty and never searched. And without his many comments on simplicity and the straightforwardness of the poem, I think it would have been more difficult to understand the scope of the undertaking and his perspective on the poem, which I think are crucial to figuring out what it means. The greatest value of his quotes lies in how they clarify the nature of the problem at hand and how one may go about solving it. There are some little nuggets of evidence in his quotes, but they’re not as important as that big-picture stuff.

Hi Jack,

First of all, Congratulations! You did what thousands of us could not.

Here are a few questions I’ve been wondering about:

1. It‘s been rumored that Forrest said you were the only person to correctly identify the hoB. As far as you know, is that a true statement? Were you the only person to correctly identify hoB?

2. Did you figure out hoB before you ever went BOTG to your search area?

3. Was Brown one of Forrest’s names for the chest and hoB the location of the chest?

Assuming that Brown was not Forrest’s name for the chest and that hoB is something that you need to be BOTG in the right area in order to identify, then it’s unlikely I’ll ever be able to get past that point in the poem.

I understand if you don’t want to answer these questions but I thought I’d try asking.

Thanks,

Redneck Girl

Thanks Redneck Girl

1. I didn’t ask him that, but it wouldn’t surprise me. At the same time, it wouldn’t surprise me if someone figured that out and hadn’t told him. I didn’t tell him what I knew it to be before I met him.

2. Yes

3. No

Jack,

Hope you are doing well. I would like to ask: what gave you confidence in your search location? I mean for me my location, Brown’s Canyon Colorado, one that I visited 40 plus times in 4 years, was derived entirely from the poem, but I was obviously wrong. And most serious searchers felt the same way about their search spots, but they too were wrong. So what was it that gave you so much confidence that your location was correct that you visited it 25 times in those two years? Can you honestly say that you knew for certain that your location was the location prior to recovery?

Thanks

Sean Dodson

Sean, for me, it was from connecting the dots and seeing the evidence. Evidence it was the place he wanted to die and evidence he saw the path there the way he describes seeing it in the poem.

Hi Jack!

Congratulations, again! I didn’t have any questions for you at first but I do have one now. :)

If you were free and clear of any legal worries, would you want other searchers, who developed a fondness of Forrest and his Chase over the years, to know the special spot?

Same question, but with a slight twist.

If you had arrived at the spot, only to realize you weren’t the first one there and the chest was gone. Would you answer the question the same way?

Thank you kindly,

Billy Shaw Jr.

1. If I could be assured the spot wouldn’t be destroyed, and Forrest was ok with it, and most of them wanted it to just be handed to them, then sure. I don’t get off on being withholding.

2. I knew where it was, so if someone else found it, I wouldn’t need to see a chest-sized depression to know where it was. I have thought about whether I would go on the internet and point out the evidence at that point in a fit of pique. I think and hope I would still keep it to myself, but who knows where my emotions would be at that point.

Do you know if the date that Forrest hid the treasure is of any significance? If so, was this info part of the ancillary evidence that aided you in the search?

Forrest said he stayed mum on the exact hiding date to prevent searchers from pulling car rental records to calculate miles driven, etc. Given that your name and travel dates are now public, any concerns that someone might try to trace your movements? (Not I, I assure you!)

Justin Fields

My car rental records aren’t public records. I doubt people would be willing to lose their job and get into legal trouble just to get that information out, and I doubt they would be as revealing as people like to think.

He told me he hid it when he did because he was in Wyoming anyway for an event at the museum in Cody, so it was convenient to hide it on the same trip.

Interesting note about the WY trip! Thanks for sharing that tidbit.

Had the blaze not been damaged, do you believe you would’ve found the spot on your first trip in 2018, or did you really need to know what blaze you were looking for in order to identify it (regardless of the condition of the blaze)?

Justin Fields

That’s tough to say because I wasn’t tracking myself with GPS and being systematic enough in 2018, but my feeling when I first went there early in the search season in 2019 was that it was an area of the forest I had never been in before. So probably not. If I had gone in that area, I probably would have needed some luck to notice it even without damage because I didn’t know what I was looking for.

Hi Jack -

Let me just add to the many congratulations you’ve already received. Well done!

I’ve been working on Forrest’s poem for about 8 years and would love to pose a few questions if you’d indulge me.

1. Are place names on a map relevant at all to the clues in the poem? I surmise that the poem itself, taken as a whole, points to one general area on a map by place name. But maybe the individual clues from there on don’t have specific place names.

2. Is any part of the solve outside of Wyoming? I know you found the chest in WY, but does the chase begin outside of that state?

Gotta say… I’m 10% jealous, but 90% thrilled for you. At this point I’m just looking for some personal satisfaction at solving it for myself. Thanks Jack!

Mike

1. I think I can answer that either way and people would quibble if they knew all the answers.

2. Nope, everything is in Wyoming.

Sooooo, is there an album or artist that you listened to that sticks out when you reminisce back on your WY adventures ? I think it would be cool to listen to that and close my eyes and envision your journey!

Thanks again Jack and completely understand if I don’t hear back from my question.

Steven

Steven, this song gave me chills when I first heard its opening lines: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=itpa_IOuz3Y

Hi Jack,

Great responses on 6 questions. Thank you for that. You are a great writer just like Forrest.

A question: If someone made a fake blaze and you publicly mentioned it was 1000 feet from the real blaze didn’t you essentially tell that person where the chest was, or do you believe the maker of the fake blaze was most likely not a Fenn searcher?

Thanks!

Dave from Reading

Thanks Dave. I left it vague enough so that everyone who left a fake blaze out there now feels bad about it and realizes they may have wasted time making a fake blaze instead of looking harder for the treasure. And I’ve had some of those people email me. Haha.

[Nick had a lot of long questions and I asked him to narrow them down]

1. “Begin it…take it…” Is “it” and actual thing and not simply “your quest”?

2. “Waters”…as in a designated body of water(s) rather than simply a plural form of water?

3. Does the Semicolon mean anything? Does it tie the 2 lines together?

4. “Been wise”…is using the past tense “been” important?

Nick

1. I think it’s possible to read that multiple ways and be correct.

2. It fits a dictionary definition of the word and is used correctly in context.

3. I would say he uses the semicolon correctly there as a connection of ideas in the stanza.

4. To me, that past tense was jarring. I always wondered if there had been an extra stanza before that he cut out to make it harder, but I forgot to ask him. I think the past tense does help you realize that there is a gap there, the search you have to do for the blaze. And then it’s past tense because you’ve then done everything you need to do to find the treasure at that point.

Hi Jack,

Wow, so congrats on doing what so many of us crazy searches tried and failed. Although, I can speak for myself that I had a lot of fun and many times felt like Alice in Wonderland :)

So, I could not help but notice that you resemble Forrest in many ways. (Hair, skin, facial structure, stature) Do you think some of these similarities in turn may have helped you find the chest? I.e. perhaps you have a similar genetic makeup and therefore you were able to think the same as Forrest. I hope this doesn’t sound crazy it’s an honest question.

Or do you think you were just able to tap into some good info through the internet (scrapbooks, videos, interview) That helped you compute out the solution?

Spallies

Thanks Spallies. I think we did think alike in some important ways, because I always found it rather easy to understand where he was coming from where I sometimes saw others struggling. I don’t know exactly how genetics or appearance plays into that, but I’m sure there are some similarities to growing up a white boy in America with an August birthday and an older brother whether it’s the 1930s or 1990s. But mostly what informed me was studying his words.

Jack,

Hi. Hopefully you can answer these questions, but I understand if not!

I had a pet theory that Forest endangered the solution by the amount of interviews he gave, and came to the conclusion that if he were to make an unguarded comment, it would have been early on in the chase and/or when asked an unusual question. Is that what you found?

Also, and perhaps you can answer this question, did Forest know at the time that he made an error? Did realize and try to backtrack? Did Forest know when you spoke to him that he’d made an error in the past?

Congratulations once again and thanks for your time,

Cheers,

Dean

Thanks Dean. I think he got into his groove with handling interviews quickly, and I certainly looked at and watched and listened to everything.

I did ask him about those two little slip-ups. He remembered one but not the other. But that second one was very subtle. He seemed satisfied overall with his performance keeping the secret, and I agree it was impressive.

I think maybe Forrest knew the blaze was damaged when he left the chest, and that’s why you would have been wise to find it. Would you say the blaze could have already been damaged when Forrest originally left the chest? Or do you think that Forrest had a different view of the chests spot with the blaze still intact? Last question is would you say the remaining clues were still traceable or were others damaged as well? I understand if you don’t have the time to answer, I appreciate you taking the time to answer my first email. I spent the last 7 summers working out in Wyoming, looking for the treasure in my spare time. I think I was very close.

Thanks again

Christopher J. Kubash

No, and he was somewhat surprised when I told him it had happened. Yes, all the other clues are recognizable out there at this point the same as when he hid it, but none of them were as susceptible to damage as the blaze was.

You’re awesome Jack thanks again for taking the time to answer me. It’s really baffling how you describe Forrest’s poem as not being a “puzzle” of sorts necessarily. If you’re saying that it’s just straight forward, loose and vague interpretations of waypoints for each clue then why would Forrest always tell us to “study every word”? Or that every word was intentional?

If the poem wasn’t a puzzle then how or why did it take him 15+ years to create supposedly?

Also on an unrelated note, what does it feel like watching and reading all these people online talk about you? I hope you are staying safe and anonymous for now. If I were in your shoes I might get my name changed and start a brand new life! Hahaha! :P

Hope you’re doing well and really appreciate again you taking time from your day to give a stranger some closure!

Maximus

I think it’s vague to the reader coming into it cold, but those words held deep meaning for him. They say exactly what he wanted to without giving too much away and requiring work to understand him to reveal what they mean. And it works as a poem that tells a coherent story.

I think some people read too much into that “15 years” comment. It’s probably something that was in the back of his mind that he came back to occasionally to work on. I don’t think he was spending hours on it each day. It doesn’t even rhyme completely.

I’m not reading much of the online conversation because the emails keep me plenty busy. Thankfully, the ratio of kind emails like yours to weird threats and conspiracy theories has been really high.

Hi Jack,

Thanks for responding to my email!

I live in the Adelaide Hills, in South Australia.

Good to hear you’re ignoring the negativity. Don’t let any of that get to you.

One last question referring to your previous answer, if you don’t mind! Roughly how big was the location or area you had decided the treasure was at? I mean was it like a football oval size area, or something bigger or smaller?

Thanks again for replying.

Best wishes,

Sean Gibbs

I haven’t measured the area I searched. It may have been bigger than a football field, but keep in mind that’s the total limits of what I thought was possible. What I considered to be probable was certainly smaller than a football field, and it was found within those probable bounds.

In the poem “Take it in the canyon down” is this referring to an actual, physical canyon? That’s not too much to give away because there’s a million canyons. But I would just like to know 2 things.

#1. Is it a physical canyon?

#2. Do you have to go physically into the canyon?

Thanks Jack, as always =)

Billy Price

Yes, the clues refer to things in the physical world, so it was a physical canyon. You do have to go down it to travel the path of the poem.

Hi Jack,

I do have a question, but first I wanted to sincerely express how much I enjoyed your YouTube video on Bias Confirmation. In my opinion, everything you said was point on. It is EXACTLY what made the hunt so difficult for so many.

I for one, was in the court of the poem being “straight forward.” And not that it matters at all to you, but I just wanted to put my thoughts in a final resting place with the person who did what no one else could. In some strange way, it will make me smile knowing you are the only person who can truly smile back….either as a delighted nod or a pitiful shake of the head! LOL!

It was Yellowstone for me from day one. In my opinion, the MOST IMPORTANT CHAPTER IS FLYWATER! Hands down! But I could never get passed my confirmation bias of Madison Junction, Firehole Canyon, Nez Perce Creek: HOB, Nez Perce/Mary Mountain trail. I never could find a blaze from there that would take me “off the trail.”

And that leads me to my question:

Forrest stated (and I’m paraphrasing) that the spot was not in “very close proximity” to a human trail. Did you indeed walk a “human trail” for a portion of your solve, or not? And do feel his statement (done in classic Fenn style, LOL!) was a hindrance or of help in the ultimate solve.

Thank you Jack for all the questions you have answered and I hope that some likeness of “normal” returns quickly to you, your family and Forrest’s family. You all deserve to finally move forward and live in peace.

Best wishes for a safe and happy New Year!

Donna-Geysergirl

Thanks Donna. I think that may narrow down things too much if I say yes or no, but I can say the whole time I was searching for the blaze and treasure in the forest, I did not step foot on a human trail. He is right that there are no man-made trails in the vicinity, but there are some game trails.

Thanks again to everyone who has sent me such kind messages and shared interesting questions and stories of your searchers and what Forrest meant to you. It’s not always easy being the finder, but it’s heartening to see how many great people are out there.

When I posted my statement revealing myself as the finder Monday, I left an email address fellow searchers could use to reach me. I figured it would be a sort of release valve for pent-up frustration and would become full of hate mail pretty quickly. But what I received surprised me.

Over the past few days, I’ve been overwhelmed with hundreds of kind, heartfelt, and congratulatory emails, and now I feel like a lousy cynic for thinking most searchers would hate me. When I interviewed with Dan Barbarisi, he told me, from his reporting the last few years, he believes there’s a silent majority of good and decent people who took up this adventure. And based on my inbox, that seems to be the case.

I never understood how Forrest put up with a lot of things, his stream of emails being one of them. But now I understand. It’s impossible not to appreciate the time these lovely people have taken to reach out, and I’ve felt compelled to write back and at least thank every one of them (sorry to anyone I missed along the way).

Searchers have shared with me treasured photos from their trips to the Rockies, interesting stories, and memories of time spent with Forrest. Many people have also sent me photos of where they thought the chest was, and several people have told me they thought they ran into me or saw my footprints somewhere while they were boots on the ground. One searcher even thought I might have left behind a pair of goggles he found in a tree.

Others hope I will answer a question or two for them, and it hasn’t been too much of an imposition for me to oblige that amount, as long as they’re aware I don’t want to reveal too much about the clues or the location to which they lead.

I don’t mind anyone sharing my emails, but I figured in the spirit of “Forrest Gets Mail,” other searchers would appreciate if I published the answers, so I asked Dal if I could share on his blog some of the interesting exchanges I’ve had thus far.

My answers below are in bold.

I do have a long list of questions, but I’m pretty sure you’ve grown weary of having answered so many. So for now, I’d like to ask just one: I believe in one of your articles, you said you found the chest after searching many days in the general search area. Did it take you to a general area after solving a “majority” of the poem, or do you think it took as long as it did because perhaps the entire poem was not solved? Forgive me if I’m encroaching or being too vague.

Thanks for taking the time.

Stanners

Stanners, I think my issue in 2018 was I didn’t know what blaze I was looking for and I wasn’t systematic enough. I fixed those before the 2019 search season, but the limiting factor after was deciding that, because I couldn’t find the blaze I was looking for, forces of nature had probably damaged or destroyed it at some point before I got there.

My strategy on the trip when I found it was to try to imagine how the blaze could have been damaged (knowing what I knew about that location) and to try to find that. But I didn’t feel my chances were good.

Can you please disclose what the “blaze” is/was? (If there’s a sound reason why you are unable to share, can you explain why not?)

Thanks and God Bless,

Jason (Yellowstone/Fairy Creek Solve)

Thanks Jason. I think that could imperil the location if it ever becomes known. Sorry, but there is a hint in the book.

Jack,

I just wanted to say congratulations on finding the chest! Like you, I put two years into looking for the treasure. Although I obviously didn’t find the chest my 2 trips to Colorado were absolutely amazing. I instantly fell in love with the Rockies. But also, I gained some lifelong friends and a new hobby in treasure hunting.

I wish you the best. I hope all this goes well and is a positive experience for you. And damn, huge shout out for figuring it out. Sounds like you put the time into solving this and are well deserved.

Again, congrats man. Well deserved!

Bill

Thanks Bill. When Forrest had me to his house, the pseudonym he used around his family for me was “Bill.”

LOL… Because it’s an awesome name of course! And if it means anything my son’s name is Jack.

Bill

Congratulations Jack,

I apologize as I’m sure you’ve been inundated with email today. I like so many others would love to know to location of the chest but fully understand your decision not to disclose it, I would have likely made the same decision had I found it myself. My biggest motivation in my many years and 100s of BOTGs searching for the chest was driven by the desire to read Forrest’s autobiography he had sealed in the olive jar… What’s you plan/intention with the autobiography? I really would love the opportunity to read it more than anything else! Again, congratulations, be well, and be safe.

Ciao,
ShadowKaster

Thanks ShadowKaster. I’ve not opened it because I think that would hurt its value substantially, though I would like to read it too (more than the little I’ve been able to see through the glass). We’ll see if whoever buys it opens it.

Forrest’s hairs (his “DNA”) are pasted onto the paper in there.

Jack,

Congratulations! I am envious and not envious at the same time. Hope you will find peace soon when this dies down.

-Dan

P.S. My spot is near Lower Slide Lake. Giggle if it’s close and scoff if it’s not!

Thanks Dan. Not confirming or ruling out anywhere in Wyoming so I will stare blankly at you.

Hello Jack, nice to meet you! I am Susie Fennhaven on Youtube. Because of TTOTC, I love Eric Sloane. I must ask, did Eric have anything to do with the solution or the location? Forrest cast his spell and finding a way forward without answers has alluded me. Thank you for everything you have shared.

Thanks Susie. I think anything that was important to Forrest could have been important to the solution, and I don’t want to narrow those things down, sorry. Eric was certainly important to Forrest.

Jack,

Congrats on finding it! Was the blaze damaged by another searcher in your opinion? Did the writer get it right that the damage hindered you?

Ray Stussy

Thanks Ray, weren’t you on Fargo? On a related note, I think this story really resonated with me and this chase: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B77ym0cWVmA&t=27

He was right it hindered me, but it was clearly damaged by forces of nature.

There’s two more I thought of. Note these are some loose end discrepancies noted by the community you may want to address as much as they are for me, though I’m curious too :) :

1. You stated on your YouTube channel that you asked Forrest about posting the uncut New Mexico Tourism video in 2019, but Forrest made a statement post-find on June 16th on Dal’s blog with the first chest picture that he hadn’t communicated with you since 2018. Can you explain the discrepancy?

2. You stated in your first Medium article that you called Forrest in 2018 and told him about a fake blaze you found about 1000 feet from the location you eventually found the treasure and you told him exactly where you were. You said when you met him post-find he had forgotten that call. It was a short call but wouldn’t he remember it since you were so close and he knew exactly where you were?

Ray Stussy

1. Sure. Not asking me before he said that, haha. I don’t know if he said that because he was so taken aback by me saying I had called him that it had prominence in his mind, he simply forgot I occasionally emailed him (which he mainly ignored), or it was just a poor choice of words, but I agree “communicated” is misleading there.

2. The reason I tortured myself over it was because he ended the call quickly after saying he couldn’t hear me. I didn’t know then if he really couldn’t or he was just shocked at what I said and wanted to get me off the phone, but I guess now it was the former.

Congratulations on finding the treasure. I completely understand your reluctance to reveal the location it was found.

In you first in post on Medium you mentioned a couple slip ups Forrest made that helped you. My question is if those helped you solve the clues in the poem, such was WWWH and HOB, or if you were able to bypass the clues and determine the location solely because of the slip ups?

Stay safe,

Joe K.

Thanks Joe. Definitely just helped, not bypassed. To me those subtle slip-ups are the exception that proves the rule — it’s really impressive how well Forrest kept his spot close to his chest.

I’m sorry but I just had a question about when you conducted the interview with Forrest. Was that available elsewhere? I don’t believe I’ve ever seen it.

Thanks,
Miriam

Miriam, I never interviewed Forrest. That was done for the New Mexico Tourism Department by a professional crew. Read the description I wrote under the video for a link to their video, which has their credits listed.

Hi Jack,

It sounds like you are saying that the clues were not as important as Forrest said they would be. Could you clarify how much you relied on the clues versus other information? In other words, could you have found the treasure using only the clues? Also, did Forrest confirm what the answers to each clue actually was?

Thank you so much for any info you can give.

Denise Baker

I brought other information to bear on the clues, but I certainly could not have found it without figuring them out. And yes, he did.

I was right on what all of them referred to, but I will say there was some additional nuance to one of them for him that I would not have expected.

I’ve dedicated just shy of a decade of my life to this hunt, and I have every intention to keep searching. Seeing and feeling that special place is at the top of my bucket list. I hope you’ll take pity on my self-inflicted obsession and consider answering the following. Please know the questions posed and any answers received will remain confidential. This is purely for my continued sanity. ;)

1. If one were to scrutinize a particular Forrest interview for anomalies and/or “slip-ups”, which video(s) would bubble to the top of your mind?

2. Which word(s) in the poem come to mind as being of extra importance?

3. Is there any additional advice you would give to someone in my position?

Justin Posey

1. I don’t want to point them out. I think every single interview is important, and just about every time I listened to or read or watched them for the umpteenth time, I made a new connection to something else he said elsewhere, and I understood him better even if it didn’t directly help me figure out where the treasure lied. I can say both are pretty subtle, but one requires far more attention to detail than the other.

2. I think it’s crucial in figuring it out not to separate out a word or clue as “most important” but rather see the poem as a coherent whole. It tells the story of a journey he took and the things he saw along the way from his perspective just like any other chapter in the memoir, and it is imbued with emotion just like every other poem he wrote. It’s one with that oeuvre, not a separate thing, and sometimes I think he did more harm than help in pointing out that it includes nine clues. I think always reminding myself that the poem itself was not the point, but rather finding the special place where he wished to die, helped me see the big picture.

3. I feel bad because I don’t want people to torture themselves over this, but obviously I don’t want to see the place destroyed. It is true that I believe there is more than enough evidence sitting in front of us and publicly available, in concert with the poem and by connecting the dots, to prove beyond a reasonable doubt where that special place is. So I do think that thrill of discovery is still available to everyone, and I think Forrest would smile to see someone else figure him out. But I’m sure I had some luck in figuring it out and fate probably helped determine what would catch my eye, so there has to be some bias there. I guess my best advice is to listen to everything Forrest has to say surrounding the subject of simplifying, and try to consider everything in context, both the big picture and small. But it’s probably true that many neurons have been connected in ways over the years for you that restrict seeing things in a new light. Forrest’s best advice began with “reading the book normally,” and I don’t think enough people actually did that first step. Maybe try beginning anew by reading TTOTC just like it was any other memoir on the shelf.

Hi Jack,

Was excited to hear another former journalist found the treasure. I do have a few questions:

- What kind of gear/day pack and navigation equipment you used (compass? All trails? Atlas?)

- what types of preparations did you have to do? Did you physically train? Get bear spray? Take a survival class?

Thanks!

Emily

Thanks Emily. Hiking pack, lots of water, a bit of packaged food, GPS (after 2018), gloves and backup gloves, bear spray for any animals looking to pick off a lone Easterner, bug spray (when I remembered, which is when they didn’t bite), a Tigers cap, watch, utility knife that I never used, sunglasses, rain jacket, and a softshell when it was colder. And my phone of course, which I used to listen to podcasts and audiobooks out loud while I was searching. Probably some things I’m forgetting too. I also brought one of those blue IKEA bags on my trips with the idea of putting the treasure in it to reinforce my pack when I carried it out. I don’t know if it helped with that, but it did help protect the interior of my pack from getting filthy from the treasure.

No training required, but I do enjoy hiking occasionally, especially when I’m in a new country.

Why is there a stick on the surface of the treasure chest?

Ty

Ty, it was a windy day when I found it, and that twig probably either snapped off a branch above and fell into the chest or I somehow knocked it in at some point without realizing it. I took those photos at the spot so Forrest could confirm for me it was the real treasure, and if so, to prove to him that I had found it. I wasn’t looking ahead of that. I didn’t notice the twig until after I pressed the button to take the photo, then tossed it aside and didn’t bother to take another photo of the same thing. If I had known the twig would become so famous, I would’ve kept it.

One more question is how did you know when you figured out a clue if it was correct or not or did you know?

Carolyn

That’s a little hard to say, Carolyn. I suppose everything fit together, and I had some evidence parts were right. And I found more evidence over time.

While I don’t expect you to reveal many, if any, details of the treasure, I do have three questions below that I’ve wondered about. It would help to provide me with closure if you were able to answer these questions. If you felt okay with sharing the answers to these questions, I would feel very grateful.

1) What was the purpose of the key inside the treasure chest?

2) What was the purpose of the scissors inside the treasure chest?

3) Did it take you two trips to retrieve the treasure as it did Forrest to hide the treasure?

Good luck to you in everything in life. There will probably be some more road bumps along the way, but it sounds like you have a very good head on your shoulders, so I have faith that you’ll be okay. Take care and I hope to hear from you soon!

Scott S.

Thanks Scott

1. That’s the key to open the front of the chest. Not very usable now that it’s rusted

2. Forrest didn’t know how those ended up in there

3. Nope, just one, but it was good exercise

I want to thank everyone again for the kind emails. I’m going to slow down on answering them now, and I hope people understand that. I’ve promised Jenny Kile a “Six Questions” next week and hope to do some kind of Q&A with searchers in the future.

My name is Jack Stuef, and I am the finder of the Forrest Fenn Treasure. I searched for it for two years, and on June 6 of this year, I retrieved the treasure from the place I found it in Wyoming, the same place Forrest hid it 10 years ago. I now own the treasure chest.

Forrest died this September, and it was a tremendous loss to many thousands of people, including those like me who were enamored with his treasure hunt. I posted my feelings on his passing here.

For the past six months, I have remained anonymous, not because I have anything to hide, but because Forrest and his family endured stalkers, death threats, home invasions, frivolous lawsuits, and a potential kidnapping — all at the hands of people with delusions related to his treasure. I don’t want those things to happen to me and my family.

The U.S. District Court for New Mexico has ruled that Forrest’s estate must provide some of my personal information to a woman I do not know and with whom I have never communicated who has brought a meritless lawsuit against me. This would make my name a matter of public record, so I chose to come forward today.

My family and I have prepared for the potentiality of this day. Since finding the treasure, I moved to a more secure building with guards and multiple levels of security, and I have taken appropriate measures to protect myself.

After I brought the treasure down from Wyoming to Santa Fe to Forrest, I put it in a vault (not Forrest’s) at a secure location in New Mexico. It will remain there until I sell it.

When I found the treasure, it ended the hopes of the many people around the world who wanted to one day find it. I understand both the disappointment and disbelief many have and are experiencing and do not take personally the vitriolic comments made about me or the conspiracy theories that some seem to find comfort. But, to be clear, I am not and was never employed by Forrest, nor did he “pick” me in any way to “retrieve” the treasure. I was a stranger to him and found the treasure as he designed it to be found.

In July, with my support, Forrest announced the fact that the treasure had been hidden and found in the state of Wyoming. This was not meant as a slight to anyone who had been searching elsewhere, but as means of providing some finality or closure.

I do not see myself as being better than anyone else who searched for the treasure because I found it. I do not think more or less of anyone based on how close they were to its location, and I don’t think anyone else should either. This treasure hunt was not a referendum on anyone’s intelligence or abilities. Rather, it was a fun challenge based on figuring out what the words of a poem meant to the elderly man who wrote them, and nothing more than that.

I do not care to spend my time disputing anyone’s convictions about where the treasure was. Everyone is entitled to their opinion in the United States of America. But when they sue me, they cross a line.

This is an abuse of the court system. I am the legitimate finder and owner of the treasure, and no person has any remotely valid claim against me. In the case in New Mexico, many bizarre, false, baseless, and defamatory allegations have been made against me. I have never hacked or stalked the plaintiff or any person, nor have I been charged with or arrested for any crime in my life, and I certainly never searched for the treasure in New Mexico. I will take appropriate legal action against anyone who makes baseless claims against me.

I’m aware some people hope this frivolous lawsuit will reveal what the clues in the poem meant and where the treasure was located, but I feel a responsibility to keep that a secret. I have never revealed where I searched for and found the chest to any person other than some whose job requires them to know that information and keep it confidential, and I never plan to do so.

When Forrest began the hunt, he never imagined it would go viral, so he never expected many of the unintended consequences that came. I don’t think Forrest wanted his chase to be defined by negativity, and neither do I. But the fact remains that some searchers have been a destructive force. Multiple people have been arrested for digging holes and trenches where they were not allowed.

If I were to reveal where the treasure was, the natural wonder of place that Forrest held so dear will be destroyed by people seeking treasure they hope I dropped on my way out or Forrest on his way in. Adding to this risk is the fact that Forrest never wrote up an inventory of what was in the chest at the time he secreted it, so I can’t prove to anyone that no item is missing from the chest. Two items that Forrest had in the past said were in the chest were not when I found it — the small gold frog on a necklace and the Spanish emerald ring found at San Lazaro. Forrest was able to locate the small frog in his vault, and it was given to me after my find. But he had no idea what happened to the emerald ring.

In addition to probable damage to the site, there is the possibility of danger to human lives. Despite Forrest’s efforts to try to help people stay safe, many people searched in impossibly dangerous locations and prohibitive winter weather conditions. Some lucky ones, after endangering emergency workers, were rescued. But others died. Getting to the wilderness location where the chest was is not dangerous in the conventional sense of the word, but it very quickly can be when people do not take basic precautions or go out in the wrong conditions. It is not an appropriate place to become a tourist attraction.

I understand that searchers have many questions for me, and I will take some time to answer them. As a start for those who are interested in my perspective on the chase, I posted a (rambling, over-intellectualized) video to YouTube in 2019 with some of my thoughts before I found the treasure. Outside magazine also has a story out today with some more information from me.

I should be clear up front about boundaries with other searchers. The treasure hunt was a personal quest for me, and I never collaborated with anyone. I understand many others see it as a community and a social thing, and I think it’s great people get different things out of what Forrest started, but that’s not what it is to me.

Forrest enjoyed meeting and conversing with many searchers over the years, but that’s not something I’m looking for. I do not wish to receive any visits to my home or phone calls or text messages from searchers. I have acquainted myself with my local laws regarding stalking and will not hesitate to call the police if someone comes to my door. If searchers feel compelled to contact me, they can email me at jack85319834@gmail.com, but keep in mind I am unlikely to read most of the messages or respond to them.

There are some positive consequences to my being outed as the finder, and I hope knowing I am a real person is a solace to some searchers still grieving the conclusion of the chase. I am optimistic that this experience will still be a positive chapter in my life.

My friend Forrest Burke Fenn passed away at the age of 90 earlier this month, and if I have anything to say about it, far too soon.

September 8 was certainly not the first time Forrest made me cry.

I am the person who found Forrest’s famed treasure. The moment it happened was not the triumphant Hollywood ending some surely envisioned; it just felt like I had just survived something and was fortunate to come out the other end. For so long, I thought I might be haunted for the rest of my days by knowing where the treasure was but being unable to find it. Would I still be out there in that section of forest 50 years from now looking for it? When I finally found it, the primary emotion was not joy but rather the most profound feeling of relief in my entire life.

I figured out the location where he wished to die (and thus, where his treasure was) back in 2018, but it took me many months to figure out the exact spot. This treasure hunt was the most frustrating experience of my life. There were a few times when I, exhausted, covered in scratches and bites and sweat and pine pitch, and nearing the end of my day’s water supply, sat down on a downed tree and just cried alone in the woods in sheer frustration.

I spent about 25 full days of failure looking for the treasure at that location before getting it.

When I got back to my rental car after the find, I put my hands on the steering wheel and bawled my eyes out. Then I remembered Forrest said the person who found the chest would either laugh out loud or start crying.

I realized he had been right and started to get annoyed that I still couldn’t stop his quotes from popping into my head even after the chase was finally done.

I laughed at myself for getting annoyed. Then I realized I had just fulfilled his other premonition about laughing out loud.

In the weeks after, I still couldn’t stop myself from reflexively thinking about what he was thinking. After living inside his head for two years, meeting him in person was sensory overload. I could now analyze his words and facial expressions and tone in real time, mere feet away from me. I could ask him questions about the chase and he would actually answer them! I never got used to it, and I was still analyzing him unnecessarily when he died, unable to turn my obsession off.

Now that he’s gone, I’m no longer annoyed those Fenn quotes are still rattling around my brain. His words will live with me and every searcher out there for the rest of our lives.

I spent a couple more days crying after Forrest passed. He had meant so much to me in such a short time, and I had so much more I had wanted to ask him, the kind of things that were just better done face to face. For weeks he had wanted to fly me back to Santa Fe to spend more time with him (he even tried to convince me to move there), but circumstances out of our control made it more practical for me to come later.

I had never met Forrest until this June, and it was destined to be our only time spent together in person.

But I’m thankful for the time we did have. When I met Forrest, I told him I hadn’t been sure I would ever get to meet him. The treasure was just too hard to find. He told me with a big smile that he had always said it was difficult to find but not impossible, and I had proved him right.

Forrest Fenn was born in 1930 in Temple, Texas. A poor student who disappointed his educator father, he grew into a life of adventure — a decorated Air Force pilot who was shot down in the Vietnam War and survived the Laos jungle, a rakish and prominent art dealer who courted the rich and famous, and, in his third and final act, a compulsive memoirist who wrote a poem that launched a treasure hunt in the Rocky Mountains that inspired many thousands of regular folks the world over.

The first line of his New York Times obituary calls him “eccentric.” “I’ve been called ‘eccentric’ and I’m flattered by that,” Forrest once said, “because the difference between an eccentric and a kook is an eccentric has money.”

Forrest Fenn was the kind of man to drink buttermilk out of the bottle. He kept alligators in the garden of his art gallery. He collected run-over soda cans as pieces of found art. He loved books and language and held onto words like “crean” that apparently nobody but he still used. He went into business with former Texas Governor John Connally, the Johnson and Nixon confidante who was wounded by the “Magic Bullet” in the Kennedy assassination, to sell Elmyr de Hory’s famed fraudulent masterpieces as fraudulent masterpieces. Forrest once shot a mountain lion and leapt down into a canyon, grabbed hold of the top of a tree, climbed down it, and tied the carcass to a rope so he could lift it out and get a $50 bounty from the Cattleman’s Association.

He was also a man with an independent mind and a security with his masculinity (perhaps uncommon to those of his generation) that allowed him to express difficult feelings and question his own decisions and values in life, becoming a pacifist after retiring from the military and even regretting that affair with the beautiful mountain lion that had run in his direction.

Forrest wrote poignantly about his struggles with self-esteem and self-worth, and it’s probably these writings I connected to most.

In the few years before I had heard of Forrest Fenn, my confidence in myself had been totally destroyed. I like to think it aided me in finding the treasure — without any self-confidence in my abilities, I had to stick to the evidence and not stray into hunches and speculation not strictly supported by the facts, and into their close cousin, confirmation bias.

Knowing the exact spot on the globe where a person would like to die is a weird intimacy to share with a stranger, but the experience of figuring it out and proving it beyond a reasonable doubt provided confidence that was intoxicating to me, and perhaps helping me regain that belief in myself will be Forrest’s greatest legacy to me. In the outpouring of love Forrest received from his fans after his death, it was clear he knew just what to say to make people feel special. For me, it was soon after I told him I found the treasure, when he let me know, completely unprompted, that he thought I was a genius.

Few human beings peak as octogenarians. For most, old age is a slow dimming of the light, but Forrest fought against that. At 80, he attracted a large audience for the first time in his writing career, and in the next decade, as he continually dealt with the passing of his peers, he made hundreds or perhaps thousands of new friends, treasure searchers he met at gatherings and sometimes in his comfortable museum of a home.

For a decade, he wrote memoir at a breakneck pace, sharing the stories of his life with great relish yet seeming to never run out of them, even when he was down to telling us about the condiments in his refrigerator and the spices in his cabinets. He didn’t seem to mind that much of his audience wasn’t really listening to what he was saying and were only looking for secret hints.

For a man who expressed anxiety about getting Alzheimer’s, he seemed to have found the perfect deterrent to cognitive decline — talking frequently and in guarded detail about a huge, closely-held secret to a cache of gold, yet never divulging it to the thousands of interested people inquiring. In a decade, he never made more than a couple of subtle slip-ups in front of all the dogged reporters who came to his house, and even those apparently haven’t been caught by anyone besides me. He never paid to advertise his hunt, yet seemingly every media outlet wanted a piece of him, and he still managed to stay sharp as a tack and “keep his secret where” till the very end.

Forrest had the ultimate poker face. In the summer of 2018, the only time I had talked to Forrest on the phone before finding the treasure, I called to tell him in desperation I had found a “blaze” — the mark that the poem says points to the treasure — that seemed after some effort by me to have been faked by a cruel fellow searcher even though it had evidently been there for years. I couldn’t believe the chances. I told him exactly where I had been searching, but the call only lasted about 20 seconds, and he gave no impression he found my discovery at all interesting.

That fake blaze was less than 1,000 feet from where I eventually found the treasure. And that’s not even the half of that story.

When I met Forrest, he had forgotten about the phone call and found it amusing when I told him. Of course, he had no idea how much I had tortured myself trying to read his reaction to that call.

Lost in some of the remembrances of Forrest is his generosity. Forrest used his chase not for personal profit, but supported a local independent bookseller and raised tens of thousands of dollars for cancer victims. He was a benefactor and donated artifacts from his personal collection over the years to the Buffalo Bill Center of the West in Cody, Wyoming, on whose board he served for several years. Despite his years of disagreements with academics over the subject of archaeology, he supported and served on the board of the George C. Frison Institute at the Department of Anthropology at the University of Wyoming. Dr. Frison passed away the very same day as Forrest.

Of course, Forrest’s greatest gift to humanity was his treasure. Sure, it could only be given to one person, the one who found it, but it inspired hope the world over and the joy of discovery for all those who got to go out and appreciate the wonders of the Rockies. No good deed goes unpunished, of course, and that hope spun off into myriad permutations Forrest couldn’t have anticipated.

In some, that hope turned into false certainty in some people’s minds, and they had to be rescued or tragically perished after finding themselves in dangerous circumstances out in the wilderness. In others, that hope turned into entitlement, that the hard work they put into this all-or-nothing hunt meant they were owed the treasure in some way, and that entitlement turned into bitterness and loud recitations of his personal imperfections that some declared to the world in the wake of his death. In others still, the hope turned into obsession that tricked their own minds into strange and harmful ideas. At my most raw points of gnawing frustration, even I resented Forrest.

Forrest had a tremendous penchant, though, for turning the other cheek. He did an incredible thing and dealt with tremendous doubt directed his way, but he kept to his word, and it was a gratifying experience to prove him right.

In a final act of selflessness, in what should have been his moment of redemption, he went to great lengths to protect my anonymity. Over the past decade, he and his family have suffered stalkers, break-ins, and a potential kidnapping (just to name the things that have been publicized) from misguided searchers. I told him I didn’t want to be looking over my shoulder for people like that for the rest of my life, and he was completely understanding. Forrest went out of his way to protect me, a person he had never met before, even though in some ways it undermined the legitimacy of this hunt in some people’s minds.

My family and I will be eternally grateful. It’s incredibly generous to leave a chest full of gold out in the wilderness for someone to find. It’s a whole other thing to set aside one’s driving desire for a legacy in order to protect that stranger. Selflessness is the only way to describe it.

When I visited Forrest’s house in June, he asked me if I had ever read his book on his friendship with the artist Eric Sloane, Seventeen Dollars a Square Inch. I hadn’t. He gave me a copy. It’s a classic Forrest Fenn production: lavish, large, very personal, a little eccentric, and totally indifferent to appealing to the book-buying public’s wallets. But of course it looks gorgeous on my coffee table.

In the craziness of the past few months, I neglected to read it, but I picked it up after Forrest passed, and I’m glad I did. It’s a loving tribute of one friend to another, and reading it has helped me with my own loss. Its dust cover says:

Eric was a gifted painter and writer, and Forrest was a grateful admirer who sold his work. Their friendship lasted only ten years, but they were very influential years. You will see.

According to page 92, Forrest and Eric are busy now working to finish the book they began together years ago, so he won’t notice if I steal and rework that passage:

Forrest was a gifted adventurer and writer, and the finder was a grateful admirer who sold his famous treasure. Their friendship lasted only three months, but they were very influential months. You will see.

Alas, I’m a millennial and have student loans to pay off, so it wouldn’t be prudent to continue to own the Fenn Treasure. And at the end of the day, for all our similarities, Forrest and I couldn’t be less alike when it comes to collecting. I’m the kind of person who feels burdened by possessions and most free adventuring the world out of a carry-on suitcase, so the treasure and I will have to soon part, and I will offer it for sale (minus the turquoise row bracelet returned to Forrest, of course).

The treasure is a unique piece of American cultural history. The gold glitters, but brighter still are the embedded hopes and dreams of all the many thousands who searched for it. It should belong to a person or institution who will fully appreciate owning such an incredible thing.

But Forrest had a final wish for where he thought the treasure should end up. The first step for me will be to try to make that happen.

As for the legacy of Forrest’s chase, I suppose it is in many ways in my hands, as wrong as that feels. To be honest, I’m not sure what to do.

Whatever. Making plans is antagonistic to freedom. You will see. I’ll be back to answer some questions, in any case.

But no, not that one.

Forrest ends Seventeen Dollars a Square Inch with a quadplet poem for Eric (republished in Scrapbook 177). “Quadplet,” of course, is one of those invented words Forrest indulged in, so who knows what it really means, but I tried writing one for my own friend:

Cold, refreshing waters babble of your life,
Whistling pines proffer your wisdoms to sup;
In your place, the mountains rumble your name;
Can I even try to shut them up?

I’m sure I will go alone in there again in the future and appreciate its beauty anew. Forrest didn’t make it back to his special place in his final hour. But when I go back some day to lie down beneath those towering pines, tilt my hat over my face to shield against the bright sun, and drift off into one more afternoon nap in that serene forest in the wilds of the Cowboy State, I know he will be resting there next to me.

I hope that place will always remain as pristine as when he first discovered it.

Two people could keep a secret. Now one of them is dead.

Many searchers know that Seventeen Dollars a Square Inch doesn’t end with just the quadplet. There were two more characters at the bottom of the page — ΩΩ. Two omegas, side by side, just like at the end of The Thrill of the Chase. I’d always thought they could possibly have been a hint to a clue in the poem, but how could they be if they were also in this earlier book about Eric Sloane? To me, there wasn’t enough evidence of intent in order to consider it a hint.

It’s something I wanted to ask Forrest about when we met again, but I never got to. Some things will always remain a mystery, and I think that’s fitting. Forrest always said he was ambivalent about whether he wanted to see the chest found in his lifetime or for the chase to last many decades after he passed, and the depth of that ambivalence profoundly revealed itself to me in the process of figuring out exactly where it was.

He was completely open with me about anything I wanted to confirm or know when we met, but his emotions were a little perplexing. I could tell there was some eagerness in finally sharing these secrets with someone, but there was also melancholy. And so perhaps it’s fitting that ambivalence ends in me knowing most of the answers but him getting to keep some of them forever.

The relevance of the double omegas will go to the grave with the man who wrote the poem.

And so it is.

ΩΩ

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