BattleTable layout redesign proposal

[ahpakar]

Overview

The original looks like this:

This proposal implements this layout:

Rationale

The changes should be pretty obvious from the comparison. Here's why I think they're necessary:

• The most important information (units' names and types, effective strength, and the outcome of the battle) should be the most prominent, so I've made them larger and given them some space.
• The modifier stack and the base strength are, in my opinion, secondary information; extra details.
• The health bar is probably the fastest and primary way to tell whether a battle is worth taking or not, so it should be large and in charge.
• The final line with the damage calculation is a bit obtuse and also uses a hyphen instead of an en dash to signify a range. I've rectified the second issue and separated it into two, since it should be small and submissive in comparison.

Alternative improvements

• I think the whole thing could use a lot more whitespace, but I won't change this because, in my opinion, it's a larger-scale problem with the entire UI, and changing one element won't solve that.
• The table is still a bit clumsy. It would be better with a Paradox-style list in my opinion, but that would take up a lot of space.
• The default colours are really ugly, especially the green, but I won't change them.
• The damage calculation line could probably be improved further somehow.

[EmperorPinguin]

I'm not a UI guy, but personally I think the current layout is very good actually.

It shows, from top to bottome: unit name, base strength, modifiers, final strength, damage taken range and final health range (in coloured bar), damage taken range and final health range (in numbers). These are all nicely ordered, and centered relative to one another. Meanwhile in your proposal it's at first glance unclear wether the green arrows belong to the the attacker or the defender.

The most important information (units' names and types, effective strength, and the outcome of the battle) should be the most prominent, so I've made them larger and given them some space.

I'd argue the unit names and types are not the most important, as they follow from the units you selected for the overview. The outcome of the battle is however, and I agree with making the coloured bar a bit fatter.

The modifier stack and the base strength are, in my opinion, secondary information; extra details.

This is primary information, you need to know both player's modifiers if you want to pareto-optimize damage economy. It is second only to the final health range statistics, as that gives information on wether the unit will be instakilled.

The default colours are really ugly, especially the green, but I won't change them.

Bright and visible, as they should be imo.

The final line with the damage calculation is a bit obtuse and also uses a hyphen instead of an en dash to signify a range. I've rectified the second issue and separated it into two, since it should be small and submissive in comparison.

More lines means more UI clutter. If it is needed to be absolutely clear, then yes, but here I don't think it adds more clarity (only more reading), and for most I think the numbers overview is supportive of the faster-to-see colour overview, not the other way around.

The damage calculation line could probably be improved further somehow.

What if it shows the actual damage instead of the 'damage range'? This information is by default available to the AI (although not used very effectively) and to reload-scumming humans (most types of damage use fixed tile and turn based RNG for a reason). Leveling the playing field for casual singleplayer humans might be a good idea, although being counter to the idea of 'surprise' and randomness to battle outcomes.

[RobLoach]

Definitely a fan of cleaning up any UI. While the Civ 5 interface can be somewhat confusing, I think we could take some inspiration from the simplicity of the Civ 6 one...

Civ 5

Civ 6

[SomeTroglodyte]

History to compare: #9205 and linked stuff.

The OCD-Friendly big overhaul was done and functional, with a slew of improvements to the detail info presented... Ultimately it fell off the wagon. IIRC due to disagreement on how to design a proper Gdx widget or somesuch. I dropped the work in April 2023, base was v 4.6.6, so merging that forward would be nigh impossible, but in case someone wants to see, I've just pushed the old branch. Warning: Goes back to Gradle 7.5 and Gdx 1.11, so expect build troubles.

[ahpakar]

I think a combination might actually be the best middle-ground. The vertical bars as in #9205 and Civ 5 are a great option. Stowing the modifier table away to the side like in Civ 6 and using colour instead of the arrows, then refocusing the strength and damage in the middle would look sensible. We don't have the “victory type” feature at all, but I'm not sure how popular that would be in the first place.

[shwwwa]

tbh i like the old one more (btw why not implement that "decisive battle" thing from civ v?)

[EmperorPinguin]

tbh i like the old one more (btw why not implement that "decisive battle" thing from civ v?)

Because it doesn't actually tell you anything really: https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/decisive-victory.390781/

[shwwwa]

tbh i like the old one more (btw why not implement that "decisive battle" thing from civ v?)

Because it doesn't actually tell you anything really: https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/decisive-victory.390781/

I agree that it is almost useless, especially for experienced players, but if you're new or looking really quick at the result it can help to recognize if the battle is advantageous for our civ, also there are still types of victories/defeats that are 100% deterministic (like if you have too much strength while fighting someone)

[shwwwa]

Also some casual players who play this game don't really use their head while playing ( (that is why civ V has a lot of very easy difficulties)

[shwwwa]

Maybe I'll create later a feature request for some sort of strategic advisors
(especially to help to tell goddamn users to create the army, because they just don't do it, and then complain that ai declares war on them, if you don't believe just check discord/itch.io)

[RobLoach]

Maybe I'll create later a feature request for some sort of strategic advisors

An Advisors mod that brings in the advisor tutorials from Civ 5, along with the speech too, is viable 😉

[EmperorPinguin]

(especially to help to tell goddamn users to create the army, because they just don't do it, and then complain that ai declares war on them, if you don't believe just check discord/itch.io)

That's more a deficiency in the current AI logic imho, their obsession with force ratings should get fixed someday.

[shwwwa]

(especially to help to tell goddamn users to create the army, because they just don't do it, and then complain that ai declares war on them, if you don't believe just check discord/itch.io)

That's more a deficiency in the current AI logic imho, their obsession with force ratings should get fixed someday.

obsession is not a bad thing either, like vox populi did it so it becomes like chess with trying to sustain an army in striving to survive on higher difficulties
i think it is just a thing that needs a good balance

[shwwwa]

Maybe I'll create later a feature request for some sort of strategic advisors

An Advisors mod that brings in the advisor tutorials from Civ 5, along with the speech too, is viable 😉

ill check it out, thanks, but I meant more those symbols on current production of the city (civ V VP-EUI mod, but it exists in base game as well) -

[EmperorPinguin]

ill check it out, thanks, but I meant more those symbols on current production of the city (civ V VP-EUI mod, but it exists in base game as well)

These symbols are in Unciv mostly on the right side of the screen, except those which aren't as they are VP-only.

[touhidurrr]

I dont like how the text is displayed here. Rest look ok.

[AdityaMH]

I dont like how the text is displayed here. Rest look ok.

You can use other font if you don't like it.

[RobLoach]

Could we also display the Unit that's fighting, addition to the icon that's displayed? Having the unit sprite in there could really help demonstrate which units are engaged.

The unitbasedescriptions civilopedia file has an example of how to display the unit sprite.

[touhidurrr]

I dont like how the text is displayed here. Rest look ok.

You can use other font if you don't like it.

This is not about fonts. The text looks cluttered.

[RobLoach]

Coming along, sounds like it needs some tweaks. Thanks!

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[AdityaMH]

@ahpakar ?